HP2019 PP1 uppgift 33

Diskussioner kring ELF-delen samt ELF-uppgifter
Jonathanberhane
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Re: HP2019 PP1 uppgift 33

Inläggav Jonathanberhane » tis 09 apr, 2019 16:21

hplover96 skrev:
tis 09 apr, 2019 16:16
Absolut, här är vår konversation.

Jag: Hello! I recently took a test here in Sweden and your article was used in a way to interpret articles and the meaning behind them. The article was about charity and the underlying motives, where in the first paragraph an anecdote is mentioned regarding church collections. I interpreted it as people give more money to charity when they know they are being watched, as in the public display of the money given makes people more willing to hand out notes, which I interpreted as more money than coins. On the other hand people interpreted your article as the peer pressure of being in a society made people more willing to donate, therefor im wondering: what was the true meaning behind the first paragraph? I'm copy pasting the first paragraph in this mail below, and I would be super happy if you had the time to answer!

Sincerely

(Här länkade jag paragrafen)

Svar: I’m not sure the two interpretations are much different!

The idea expressed in the anecdote (which I am not necessarily endorsing) is that people are more likely to “do good” when they are seen to be doing good and less likely to do so when their goodness goes unnoticed. “Knowing you’re being watched” and “peer pressure” are in this instance two ways of describing more or less the same thing, with different emphasis. If you didn’t feel peer pressure then knowing you were being watched would not have an effect.

Does that make sense?

Jag: Yes that makes a lot of sense, and thank you for the response. What confused me, and a lot of students for that matter, was in the way the answers were designed. There were four options, but two of them stood out and meant basicly the same thing. I will link the two answers to you and hoping you could give me your input in as how to interpret them. I believe the biggest issue here is how to interpret the word "social factors", since the automatic translation to swedish gives the concept a different meaning than what is usually thought out as to be social factors(socioeconomic status?).

Here are the two options, and we had to keep in mind to only use the first paragraph in answering. Do you share my confusion?
1. People tend to give away more money if they know they are being watched
2. Social factors are relevant regarding people’s willingness to donate money.

Sincerely

Svar: Agree – bad question as both answers are true.
Ni kan omöjligen, efter hennes uttalande, fortfarande hävda att D bör vara rätt. :lol:

hplover96
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Re: HP2019 PP1 uppgift 33

Inläggav hplover96 » tis 09 apr, 2019 16:23

Glömde dock lägga till att det skulle vara "the main argument", väntar fortfarande på svar angående detta. Får se vad han säger.
Senast redigerad av 1 hplover96, redigerad totalt 0 gånger.

drnorth
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Re: HP2019 PP1 uppgift 33

Inläggav drnorth » tis 09 apr, 2019 16:26

Jonathanberhane skrev:
tis 09 apr, 2019 16:21
Ni kan omöjligen, efter hennes uttalande, fortfarande hävda att D bör vara rätt. :lol:
Skojar du eller? Står ju svart på vitt i sista svaret att båda svaren stämmer :P

drnorth
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Re: HP2019 PP1 uppgift 33

Inläggav drnorth » tis 09 apr, 2019 16:27

hplover96 skrev:
tis 09 apr, 2019 16:16
Absolut, här är vår konversation.
Förtjänstfullt och riktigt outside the box-tänk av dig att kontakta författaren, imponerande! Tack för att du delade med dig :)

bluphp
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Re: HP2019 PP1 uppgift 33

Inläggav bluphp » tis 09 apr, 2019 16:28

Jonathanberhane skrev:
tis 09 apr, 2019 16:21
hplover96 skrev:
tis 09 apr, 2019 16:16
Absolut, här är vår konversation.

Jag: Hello! I recently took a test here in Sweden and your article was used in a way to interpret articles and the meaning behind them. The article was about charity and the underlying motives, where in the first paragraph an anecdote is mentioned regarding church collections. I interpreted it as people give more money to charity when they know they are being watched, as in the public display of the money given makes people more willing to hand out notes, which I interpreted as more money than coins. On the other hand people interpreted your article as the peer pressure of being in a society made people more willing to donate, therefor im wondering: what was the true meaning behind the first paragraph? I'm copy pasting the first paragraph in this mail below, and I would be super happy if you had the time to answer!

Sincerely

(Här länkade jag paragrafen)

Svar: I’m not sure the two interpretations are much different!

The idea expressed in the anecdote (which I am not necessarily endorsing) is that people are more likely to “do good” when they are seen to be doing good and less likely to do so when their goodness goes unnoticed. “Knowing you’re being watched” and “peer pressure” are in this instance two ways of describing more or less the same thing, with different emphasis. If you didn’t feel peer pressure then knowing you were being watched would not have an effect.

Does that make sense?

Jag: Yes that makes a lot of sense, and thank you for the response. What confused me, and a lot of students for that matter, was in the way the answers were designed. There were four options, but two of them stood out and meant basicly the same thing. I will link the two answers to you and hoping you could give me your input in as how to interpret them. I believe the biggest issue here is how to interpret the word "social factors", since the automatic translation to swedish gives the concept a different meaning than what is usually thought out as to be social factors(socioeconomic status?).

Here are the two options, and we had to keep in mind to only use the first paragraph in answering. Do you share my confusion?
1. People tend to give away more money if they know they are being watched
2. Social factors are relevant regarding people’s willingness to donate money.

Sincerely

Svar: Agree – bad question as both answers are true.
Ni kan omöjligen, efter hennes uttalande, fortfarande hävda att D bör vara rätt. :lol:

Hahah, va? Författaren svarade ju med att frågan var dålig då båda alternativen var rätt? Skönt iallafall med lite input från författaren själv, känns som ett starkt argument att framföra till UHR om frågans ambivalens.

bluphp
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Re: HP2019 PP1 uppgift 33

Inläggav bluphp » tis 09 apr, 2019 16:29

hplover96 skrev:
tis 09 apr, 2019 16:23
Glömde dock lägga till att det skulle vara "the main argument", väntar fortfarande på svar angående detta. Får se vad han säger.
Ja, dela gärna med dig av svaret sen! Hade du tänkt mejla till UHR imorgon?

hplover96
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Re: HP2019 PP1 uppgift 33

Inläggav hplover96 » tis 09 apr, 2019 16:34

Ja jag tänkte mejla imorgon och vidarebefordra vår mejlkonversation som grund för argumentationen. :)

Jonathanberhane
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Re: HP2019 PP1 uppgift 33

Inläggav Jonathanberhane » tis 09 apr, 2019 16:49

bluphp skrev:
tis 09 apr, 2019 16:28
Jonathanberhane skrev:
tis 09 apr, 2019 16:21
hplover96 skrev:
tis 09 apr, 2019 16:16
Absolut, här är vår konversation.

Jag: Hello! I recently took a test here in Sweden and your article was used in a way to interpret articles and the meaning behind them. The article was about charity and the underlying motives, where in the first paragraph an anecdote is mentioned regarding church collections. I interpreted it as people give more money to charity when they know they are being watched, as in the public display of the money given makes people more willing to hand out notes, which I interpreted as more money than coins. On the other hand people interpreted your article as the peer pressure of being in a society made people more willing to donate, therefor im wondering: what was the true meaning behind the first paragraph? I'm copy pasting the first paragraph in this mail below, and I would be super happy if you had the time to answer!

Sincerely

(Här länkade jag paragrafen)

Svar: I’m not sure the two interpretations are much different!

The idea expressed in the anecdote (which I am not necessarily endorsing) is that people are more likely to “do good” when they are seen to be doing good and less likely to do so when their goodness goes unnoticed. “Knowing you’re being watched” and “peer pressure” are in this instance two ways of describing more or less the same thing, with different emphasis. If you didn’t feel peer pressure then knowing you were being watched would not have an effect.

Does that make sense?

Jag: Yes that makes a lot of sense, and thank you for the response. What confused me, and a lot of students for that matter, was in the way the answers were designed. There were four options, but two of them stood out and meant basicly the same thing. I will link the two answers to you and hoping you could give me your input in as how to interpret them. I believe the biggest issue here is how to interpret the word "social factors", since the automatic translation to swedish gives the concept a different meaning than what is usually thought out as to be social factors(socioeconomic status?).

Here are the two options, and we had to keep in mind to only use the first paragraph in answering. Do you share my confusion?
1. People tend to give away more money if they know they are being watched
2. Social factors are relevant regarding people’s willingness to donate money.

Sincerely

Svar: Agree – bad question as both answers are true.
Ni kan omöjligen, efter hennes uttalande, fortfarande hävda att D bör vara rätt. :lol:

Hahah, va? Författaren svarade ju med att frågan var dålig då båda alternativen var rätt? Skönt iallafall med lite input från författaren själv, känns som ett starkt argument att framföra till UHR om frågans ambivalens.
"Two ways of describing more or less the same thing, with different emphasis."
Tolkar det som att hon anser att båda kan stämma, om man emellertid ser till hp:s "regelverk" ska man alltid utgå ifrån det svarsalternativ som "stämmer bäst överens med texten". Och i det här fallet anser jag, och många andra att C stämmer BÄST överens med det som efterfrågas.
Senast redigerad av 1 Jonathanberhane, redigerad totalt 0 gånger.

hunnrasexti
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Re: HP2019 PP1 uppgift 33

Inläggav hunnrasexti » tis 09 apr, 2019 16:52

Nu jävlar! Nu ska vi analysera ihjäl författarens mail också =)

erik-w
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Re: HP2019 PP1 uppgift 33

Inläggav erik-w » tis 09 apr, 2019 16:55

Jonathanberhane skrev:
tis 09 apr, 2019 16:21
hplover96 skrev:
tis 09 apr, 2019 16:16
Absolut, här är vår konversation.

Jag: Hello! I recently took a test here in Sweden and your article was used in a way to interpret articles and the meaning behind them. The article was about charity and the underlying motives, where in the first paragraph an anecdote is mentioned regarding church collections. I interpreted it as people give more money to charity when they know they are being watched, as in the public display of the money given makes people more willing to hand out notes, which I interpreted as more money than coins. On the other hand people interpreted your article as the peer pressure of being in a society made people more willing to donate, therefor im wondering: what was the true meaning behind the first paragraph? I'm copy pasting the first paragraph in this mail below, and I would be super happy if you had the time to answer!

Sincerely

(Här länkade jag paragrafen)

Svar: I’m not sure the two interpretations are much different!

The idea expressed in the anecdote (which I am not necessarily endorsing) is that people are more likely to “do good” when they are seen to be doing good and less likely to do so when their goodness goes unnoticed. “Knowing you’re being watched” and “peer pressure” are in this instance two ways of describing more or less the same thing, with different emphasis. If you didn’t feel peer pressure then knowing you were being watched would not have an effect.

Does that make sense?

Jag: Yes that makes a lot of sense, and thank you for the response. What confused me, and a lot of students for that matter, was in the way the answers were designed. There were four options, but two of them stood out and meant basicly the same thing. I will link the two answers to you and hoping you could give me your input in as how to interpret them. I believe the biggest issue here is how to interpret the word "social factors", since the automatic translation to swedish gives the concept a different meaning than what is usually thought out as to be social factors(socioeconomic status?).

Here are the two options, and we had to keep in mind to only use the first paragraph in answering. Do you share my confusion?
1. People tend to give away more money if they know they are being watched
2. Social factors are relevant regarding people’s willingness to donate money.

Sincerely

Svar: Agree – bad question as both answers are true.
Ni kan omöjligen, efter hennes uttalande, fortfarande hävda att D bör vara rätt. :lol:

Det står klart och tydligt i författarens svar att både C & D kan vara rätt.
Ärligt talat, om du inte ens kan läsa och förstå den där texten är det uppenbart att du inte klarar av att förstå texten från provet.

hplover96
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Re: HP2019 PP1 uppgift 33

Inläggav hplover96 » tis 09 apr, 2019 17:03

Nu kom svaret.

Jag: Exactly! What I forgot to mention though was that the question was this: What is the main argument in the opening paragraph?

Would you say that changes your mind, and that it is more inclined towards the 2nd alternative?

Thank you for the response.

Sincerely

Svar: Yes , I think No 2 because the main point is the general one not the specific example. But this is arguable so the question remains not so good.

JB

erik-w
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Re: HP2019 PP1 uppgift 33

Inläggav erik-w » tis 09 apr, 2019 17:06

hplover96 skrev:
tis 09 apr, 2019 17:03
Nu kom svaret.

Jag: Exactly! What I forgot to mention though was that the question was this: What is the main argument in the opening paragraph?

Would you say that changes your mind, and that it is more inclined towards the 2nd alternative?

Thank you for the response.

Sincerely

Svar: Yes , I think No 2 because the main point is the general one not the specific example. But this is arguable so the question remains not so good.

JB

Och där har vi det, även själva författaren lutar också åt D. Slut på diskussion.

hplover96
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Re: HP2019 PP1 uppgift 33

Inläggav hplover96 » tis 09 apr, 2019 17:14

D är antagligen mer korrekt, men båda skulle kunna fungera. Om man däremot gör som HP-akademin och ser till just begreppet "social factors" som just socioekonomisk status, då har vi enbart ett alternativ som kan vara korrekt – alternativ C. Det bästa är antagligen om frågan stryks. Själv tolkade jag just social factors som socioekonomisk status och avfärdade alternativ D genast, var det ingen som gjorde lika dant?

drnorth
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Re: HP2019 PP1 uppgift 33

Inläggav drnorth » tis 09 apr, 2019 17:21

hplover96 skrev:
tis 09 apr, 2019 17:14
D är antagligen mer korrekt, men båda skulle kunna fungera. Om man däremot gör som HP-akademin och ser till just begreppet "social factors" som just socioekonomisk status, då har vi enbart ett alternativ som kan vara korrekt – alternativ C. Det bästa är antagligen om frågan stryks. Själv tolkade jag just social factors som socioekonomisk status och avfärdade alternativ D genast, var det ingen som gjorde lika dant?
Jag tänker egentligen att C är mer korrekt just eftersom du säger kan D verkligen förkastas om social factors enbart skulle betyda socioekonomisk status, osv. Svarade D så jag hoppas väl ändå att båda blir rätt på nåt vis. Tycker inte om att godtycke ska få avgöra något så viktigt.

GemTwist
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Re: HP2019 PP1 uppgift 33

Inläggav GemTwist » tis 09 apr, 2019 17:34

Ska jag vara helt ärlig så borde C vara helt fel. Anledningen är att det aldrig nämns i texten att folk faktiskt ger MER, det kan var att de lägger 30 st mynt tior i påsen men bara en 20-kronors sedel på fatet. Och under alla de andra proven jag gjort både hemma och i provsalen har det varit väldigt noga med orden och tankesättet har alltid (som jag sett det) varit som jag nyss nämnde det.
Det hänvisas aldrig att det ges mer.
Och "social factors" har mer än en betydelse. UHR kan omöjligt ge fel för att de menade något helt annat med ordet "social factors" då det har mer än en betydelse. En människa som kan läsa engelska flytande och avancerat bör kunna tolka in ordet till vad det borde betyda i sammanhanget.
Var själv på väg att välja C men gjorde inte det pga ordet "more".


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